Spectrum Computing

The trascendental question we all have in mind. Sort of.

Vote.

The adventure component made my vote go to JSW. And I never go further than 3d screen in Manic Miner, I think

Easy one for me, MM.

I've never been a big traveller so JSW's sprawling map was too overwhelming for me, I never felt like I had a chance of completing it (little did I know it was physically impossible anyway!).

MM you can take screen by screen, and see your progress, or not. I think the Processing plant was my best BITD, now it's the Warehouse - but I WILL COMPLETE IT SOMEDAY, on bread & water.

This goes for both but, the graphics, personality, levels - superb. To think Matt Smith did it when he was 17 astounds me, I was just about toilet trained at that age.

Juan F. Ramirez wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2017 7:21 am I never go further than 3d screen in Manic Miner, I think

For shame.

It's a tricky one! I have very fond memories of both. MM was the first game I got back in Christmas 1983 and the whole family tried it out. Amazing though it seems these days - nobody was able to get beyond the Central Cavern until IIRC my Aunt managed it after playing for hours once I had gone to bed!

Jetset Willy was another dimension - the anticipation in the run up to its release, and then the first time I played it having been down to WHSmith on a Saturday morning to grab my copy. It seemed incredible that a game could be so big and I spent hours and hours exploring. The fact that it couldn't be completed was irrelevant - I just wanted to see if I could visit every screen.

Both games are legendary - but because of the fun I had exploring, and the anticipation in the run up and the fact that for a couple of weeks - everyone in the playground seemed to be talking about JSW, it gets my vote.

ramsrc wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2017 8:28 am Amazing though it seems these days - nobody was able to get beyond the Central Cavern until IIRC my Aunt managed it after playing for hours once I had gone to bed!

Heh brilliant. I'm trying imagine any of my Aunt's managing to make willy jump let alone finish.

(Err)

Back in the day I preferred JSW, seemed so much more to it and each game could be different, depending on where you go. Nowadays I am quite likely to play MM, as I can have a quick game and see how many screens I can complete before moving on to something else. JSW just seems a bit to open ended for my lifestyle at the moment.

For the record I never did complete MM, or get particularly far in JSW when I was younger.

I've spent more time playing JSW as I love exploring the mansion but Manic Miner is the better game. One thing I don't understand is why Eugene's Lair is feared by so many. It's one of the easier screens!

I'm okay with it now but Eugene's lair used to cause me no end of problems. It was mainly the second platform down where you had to jump over Eugene and still avoid the black toilet.

Hmm. Both have always annoyed me to no end.

R-Tape wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:18 am Heh brilliant. I'm trying imagine any of my Aunt's managing to make willy jump let alone finish.

Amazingly, she went out and bought a Spectrum straight after that Christmas!

As for Eugene's Lair - I never had too much problem with it, once I got the timing right on the second platform, and the long jump in the bottom right hand corner. Some of the later screens are really hard and I don't think (IIRC) I got past the Warehouse without cheating.

I was crap at both. Eugene's Lair was usually the end for me in Manic Miner

But I prefer Manic Miner as it's smaller and you have this feeling of achievement when you completed some screens. In Jet Set Willy I had a walk through few locations and turned it off with feeling that I achieved nothing. It was a too hardcore game for me in the 80s and is even more hardcore for me now.

Has to be Jet Set Willy, it was probably the first exposure to truly "open world" games and provided endless fascination just wandering off to find new rooms - trying to actually complete it wasn't even part of why I played it back in the day (though I have done since). Not until the likes of Knightlore and Head Over Heels did anything else quite meet that glorious ability to just roam around.

I loved exploring in Jet Set Willy when I got it, but the problem was that once you'd seen all the screens - and the ones 'under the drive' were ridiculously hard to reach - you realised there was no way in hell you'd be able to do all that and collect the objects along the way. A few of the screens you had to get through were far, far harder than anything in Manic Miner so playing it any further just seemed like a lost cause.

Manic Miner had a much better design, with the levels getting tougher as you progress but rewarding once you master them. I can now complete it. 'The Warehouse' needs a particular path to complete it, like 'The Bank' but all in one go without stopping. Same with 'Skylab landing bay', although that has a few safe spots. 'Amoebatron's Revenge' is a tough one for hitting your head on things above, and 'Solar Power Generator' is just about flat-out speed.

Also, if you do lose all your lives and need to start again, it's not as much of your life down the drain as if you've done a load of JSW and then die.

Went for MM.

Liked the exploration side of JSW but the 'next screen!' enthusiasm in MM had me gripped.

Difficult choice though, ask me a different year and I'd probably change my mind.

Dark wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:05 am Back in the day I preferred JSW, seemed so much more to it and each game could be different, depending on where you go. Nowadays I am quite likely to play MM, as I can have a quick game and see how many screens I can complete before moving on to something else. JSW just seems a bit to open ended for my lifestyle at the moment.

I'm the same. Went for MM, but the much younger me would have chosen JSW.

Would anyone say MM 'saved' the spectrum?
ie
it was the first game that wasn't a bit crap, and had that long term playability.

I wouldn't say it 'saved' it - it wasn't really in any trouble from anything else. It did shift the goalposts for other game developers though, meaning they all had to try a bit harder - but mainly just in the field of platform games. Ultimate's early games like Cookie and Atic Atac were just as influential in showing a level of quality well above the norm.

Wall_Axe wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:22 pm Would anyone say MM 'saved' the spectrum?

I wouldn't. The Spectrum was already the best-selling home computer in the UK. As Joefish said, there were plenty of good games emerging (Ant Attack is another one). I think MM amd JSW's biggest influence was to give us a flood of platform clones.

Jet Set Willy. Was one of the first games I had bought for me after I got my Spectrum Plus in 1984. My Dad got it on a shopping trip to Asda - they used to sell computer cassettes in a metal rack there. The cover art must have swung it. My brother and I played it constantly. The mansion seemed alive and if you couldn't do a room, you could move on to another one or explore another part of the mansion. People would discuss it non stop at school - reports of rooms went round the playground, some real (The Bridge, The Watchtower) some false (the boat sailing away at a given time). It had it's own lore and spawned a mod scene that's still going today. I played Manic Miner some years after and while the loading screen, title screen and music are better, the gameplay where you can get stuck at a certain cave until you got better didn't appeal after the freedom of the mansion.

Wall_Axe wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:22 pm Would anyone say MM 'saved' the spectrum?

I think, if anything, time saved the Spectrum.

As time progressed, programmers found out more ways to coax performance and graphics out of the Spectrum - and games improved as a result. If the Spectrum had been replaced with a new model sooner, then the quality of the games probably wouldn't be as good.

If you look at the quality of games for the ZX81 - which had a relatively short production life, compared to the Spectrum and you'll see what I am trying to get at. As the years have passed, the ZX81 hobbyists have managed to do things that would have been thought impossible BITD.

bob_fossil wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2017 11:08 pm some false (the boat sailing away at a given time). It had it's own lore and spawned a mod scene that's still going today.

I heard that one too!

Plus that flaming trailer in Lunar Jetman. I must have spent hours looking for that!

Wasn't the island an April Fools thing in Crash?

And I think the Lunar Jetman trailer mockup appeared in that mag too.

Morkin wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:07 am Wasn't the island an April Fools thing in Crash?

And I think the Lunar Jetman trailer mockup appeared in that mag too.

Next you'll be telling me Lloyd Mangram didn't exist.