Which games really pushed the Speccy?

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ZXDunny
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Re: Which games really pushed the Speccy?

Post by ZXDunny » Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:06 pm

AndyC wrote:
Mon Jul 09, 2018 5:44 pm
ZXDunny wrote:
Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:28 am
Yes, games that pushed the hardware to do things it wasn't supposed to be able to do. KL was not one of these. But even if we were to include games that pushed people's expectations of what could be done then KL still won't make the grade - Isometric 3D was really nothing innovative by the time it came out, whereas Freescape was innovative; it hadn't been done before on the Spectrum to that degree.
I'm not a fan of Knightlore, but when it came out it certainly did raise the bar considerably in the overall quality of Spectrum games. Isometrics had been done, but not with the level of graphical finesse that Knightlore had. Indeed most games had to up there overall effort with graphics after Knightlore came out.

Now it looks dated, has clunky controls and massive gameplay flaws, but you have to look at it from a contempory point of view. If you don't then really the only things that come close to counting are some of the multicolor games of recent years, Freescape and maybe a Doom demo game. And it's entirely possible that you'll have to ditch those in a year or so when someone out-does them.
I bought it when it came out - I was a massive Ultimate fan and after Atic Atac, Jet Pac, Sabre Wulf I felt they could do no wrong. I grabbed Knightlore and found it massively disappointing. Very sparse colour, awful gameplay and dull, dull, dull. I almost skipped Underwurlde the next time I was in town; I'm glad I didn't as it was a great return to form. I was however quite young (10 or 11 iirc) so I was probably not the target audience for KL unfortunately.

It wasn't until HoH that I got back into the isometric genre - and although again it was not particularly colourful, it did at least have a game in there.
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Ersh
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Re: Which games really pushed the Speccy?

Post by Ersh » Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:37 pm

.
Here's what Jon Ritman had to say about the game. (Taken from an interview here.)
"They gave me a copy of the game, I put it on and was just blown away. It was a Disney film you could play. It was just...great." The game was what many still today consider Ultimate's finest hour: Knight Lore. "I was just going 'how the f*** do they do that?'" smiles Ritman. "I didn't even understand how they made the graphics overlay on each other. Cleanly, and not in straight lines, in diagonals too. So I went home and started to try and work out how it was done, and work out a system that did it better."
No Knight Lore, no Batman, no Head over Heels. It paved the way for a sea of games in the same vein and to me that's at least pushing the envelope if not the hardware.

Not a big fan of the isometric games on the Speccy myself, The Great Escape being an exception.
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Pegaz
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Re: Which games really pushed the Speccy?

Post by Pegaz » Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:23 pm

I cant believe Jon Ritman said this, for such a dull and disappointing game...
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Juan F. Ramirez
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Re: Which games really pushed the Speccy?

Post by Juan F. Ramirez » Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:30 pm

Pegaz wrote:
Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:23 pm
I cant believe Jon Ritman said this, for such a dull and disappointing game...
1000 lines, Eric!!!
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ZXDunny
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Re: Which games really pushed the Speccy?

Post by ZXDunny » Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:55 pm

Pegaz wrote:
Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:23 pm
I cant believe Jon Ritman said this, for such a dull and disappointing game...
Me neither, but there you go.
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Wall_Axe
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Re: Which games really pushed the Speccy?

Post by Wall_Axe » Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:37 am

was knight lore the first game to have that quality of character sprite/animation?
you also had the transformation which did remind me of a cartoon and expressions on the character's faces.

if KL had been a boring character sprite I dont think the game would have had as much impact.
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beanz
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Re: Which games really pushed the Speccy?

Post by beanz » Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:34 pm

Knightlore and doom are the only games that really gave me a 'wow' moment when I first saw them moving (Rather than just still images)
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stupidget
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Re: Which games really pushed the Speccy?

Post by stupidget » Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:28 pm

Don't get me wrong, KL is indeed a great game and for the time was an amazing achievement, but, can you compare it to Castle Master, Driller, Doom or Carrier Command with regards to what it was actually getting the Speccy to do?
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AndyC
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Re: Which games really pushed the Speccy?

Post by AndyC » Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:03 pm

Wall_Axe wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:37 am
was knight lore the first game to have that quality of character sprite/animation?
you also had the transformation which did remind me of a cartoon and expressions on the character's faces.

if KL had been a boring character sprite I dont think the game would have had as much impact.
It's certainly the first one I remember, it stood out amongst the other games of the time as being vastly superior graphically compared to other titles.
stupidget wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:28 pm
Don't get me wrong, KL is indeed a great game and for the time was an amazing achievement, but, can you compare it to Castle Master, Driller, Doom or Carrier Command with regards to what it was actually getting the Speccy to do?
Don't get me wrong, KL is boring as hell, the controls are terrible and it was vastly outdone by the Ritman games. But it came before those and a long time before the Freescape titles and had an enormous impact.

Honestly I think it was more impressive at it's launch than Driller was at its. Which might seem weird from a technical perspective, but as time went on people became more confident of what could be achieved on the machine and Knightlore was one of, if not the, tipping point when developers really started to see that the machine was capable of a lot more than the relatively simplistic titles that had preceded it.
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Re: Which games really pushed the Speccy?

Post by Morkin » Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:50 pm

Juan F. Ramirez wrote:
Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:16 am
I of the Mask seems to be another candidate. Technically amazing by that year (1986) but boring as hell.

Sandy White himself admitted it was more a tech demo than a game.

Regarding Knight Lore, I enjoyed playing it at the time, and thought it was quite a novel idea, an iso platformer, rather than it just being about the graphics. Though I agree it hasn't aged as well as other Ultimate games.

I think that's why I wasn't a big fan of Batman, HoH etc. - there had been so many imitations by then they didn't really grab me, however well they were executed.

I was very impressed with Driller & Freescape, though it did get a bit sluggish at times.
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