Spectrum Computing

This is arguably OT, but IMO still has some relevance to the forum, so have put it under 'Website'.

I recently came to a realisation about something of which I’m genuinely ashamed: I’m middle aged and I don’t know how to write English — either casually or formally. I may have done a bit of it at school, and it’s possible I just didn’t pay attention, but to be honest all I remember is the teacher saying “use a comma when you would pause for breath”. But I think it was mostly assumed that because we could speak it — we could write it.

So recently, I went back and learned the basics of grammar and punctuation; and now that I’ve hopefully attained the giddy heights of key stage 2 or 3, I feel crippled by this little knowledge. I now know that I’ve been splicing commas all over the spot for decades, but feel more comfortable with that than using the semicolon in a forum post! I’m not even confident I’m using them correctly, as my ‘work’ has never been validated. So I’m toggling between my previous, natural way of writing, and a more formal manner (that is hopefully about right). As a result I’m being totally inconsistent and am now terrified of getting it wrong or appearing stuffy. I'm also using colons and semicolons all over the spot, which can't be right.

I've never had to think about any of this before: ARGHHHHH!

TLDR: Am I alone in this lack of confidence? Do you know how to use a semicolon, colon, em dash, en dash and hyphen correctly? Do you know when you’re splicing a comma? Does any of this matter on an internet forum? HELP!

(Obviously I haven't mentioned spelling and apostrophes, as they should be a given )

I wouldn't worry about it Dave. Don't let is spoil your creative spirit. I was amazed at work to find that Microsoft Outlook now supports Emoji. I can't imagine anyone using a smiley face in any business email, but perhaps I'm just way out of touch.

As long as it looks good and reads as you want, then go with it.
Just make sure that the their, they're, there, where, were, we're are correct, otherwise the grammar police will laugh.
Do I use the ` (left of 1) or ' (between L and Return) as an apostrophe? I find ' (L and Return) easier to press.

I've noticed that I have a bad habit of switching between past and present tense within a written sentence though.

Let the Key stage people read the above and rip it apart....... (damn, too many full stops).

Um, ah, oh. As long as we can understand what you are saying (at least, I think that we may want to understand what you are saying...) it doesn't really matter...

One of the most important concepts that no one told me (at least, I don't think anyone told me), is that in real speech, there are very few pauses and breaks. It's your brain that separates the run of continuous speech into the distinct and separate words. Listen to someone speaking in a language that you don't speak to see what I mean.

One thing that I was told in English class at school. Try to keep sentences to a reasonable length. Don't ramble on with long sentences packed full of commas.

Mark

PeterJ wrote: ↑Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:15 pm I wouldn't worry about it Dave. Don't let is spoil your creative spirit. I was amazed at work to find that Microsoft Outlook now supports Emoji. I can't imagine anyone using a smiley face in any business email, but perhaps I'm just way out of touch.

There are loads of different nationalities of varying fluency at my workplace, so Emojis are vital for me to ensure I don't offend a visitor with a badly judged ironic joke!

MatGubbins wrote: ↑Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:29 pm As long as it looks good and reads as you want, then go with it.

Good counsel, I think I'm still finding my feet. (<comma splice)

Just make sure that the their, they're, there, where, were, we're are correct

Definitely agree, these are the low hanging fruit and it should be a given that we get them right.(<comma splice)

I've noticed that I have a bad habit of switching between past and present tense within a written sentence though.

Nooo! Something else to worry about.

1024MAK wrote: ↑Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:33 pm One thing that I was told in English class at school. Try to keep sentences to a reasonable length. Don't ramble on with long sentences packed full of commas.

I vaguely remember this, but don't remember being told that I've been splicing my commas. Personally I think the comma splice is okay!

Actually, if I was to analyse it, isn't Mark's post comprised of too many short, abrupt sentences? Technically, shouldn't it be like this?

One thing that I was told in English class at school: try to keep sentences to a reasonable length; Don't ramble on with long sentences packed full of commas.

ARGH!

One thing that I was told in English class at school. Try to keep sentences to a reasonable length. Don't ramble on with long sentences packed full of commas.

Haaaaaaaang onnnnnnnnnnn; it gets worse: ^that's TWO things!

As if the waters weren't muddy enough, how should a contemporary game designer approach correct usage if they were writing a text adventure?

This is a nightmare!

R-Tape wrote: ↑Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:00 pm Do you know how to use a semicolon, colon, em dash, en dash and hyphen correctly?

Yep.

R-Tape wrote: ↑Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:00 pmDoes any of this matter on an internet forum?

The question is: does it matter to you? Grammar and punctuation conventions are more than just esthetics—they aid in communication. If you want to make sure you’re not misunderstood, it’s a good idea to try to adhere to these rules. How important is this to you? That’s for you to decide.

Obviously, well written, correctly punctuated (and spelled) posts are a joy to read. The hidden—or, rather, less obvious—part of that joy is the fact that it takes less effort to parse such posts for an educated reader.

That said, we all (and I mean all, including us copyeditors), get sloppy sometimes; whether due to a rush (who has the time to re-read his own post several times before hitting the Submit button, anyway?), or due to laziness (okay, is this a forum post or a book I’m submitting to a publisher after all?), we always find excuses—often, quite legitimate—to not go over our writing.

I resigned my position in the Grammar Police Force years ago, yet I still tend to skip over poorly written or formatted posts.

R-Tape wrote: ↑Fri Sep 14, 2018 10:09 pm As if the waters weren't muddy enough, how should a contemporary game designer approach correct usage if they were writing a text adventure?

That’s easy—as with any writing, hire (bribe, kidnap) a copyeditor.

MatGubbins wrote: ↑Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:29 pm Do I use the ` (left of 1) or ' (between L and Return) as an apostrophe? I find ' (L and Return) easier to press.

Yes, the (typewriter) apostrophe key is there to be easy to use. There’s basically no reason to ever use the grave accent key unless you’re writing shell scripts or some forrin language

If you were feeling particularly clever (or typesetting a book) you’d use proper unicode apostrophes rather than typewriter apostrophes like I’ve done throughout this post just to show off

As Ast A. Moore says, Grammar and punctuation are only there to aid in accuracy of communication. Unless you're trying to get a legal or scientific point across, it doesn't really matter very much. Fortunately for those fields that do require precise communication, their language structure and meaning has been set in stone.

Colloquial language is evolving all the time, as are the rules that govern it. What was acceptable two hundred years ago looks awful now, and vice-versa, were that actually possible.

So who really cares? If someone takes the time to kindly correct your grammar, or your punctuation or spelling, then kindly thank them and move on, safe in the knowledge that they're probably a friendless anal twat with some god-awful hangups that you don't really want to communicate with anyway.

I’ve always found you to be a very good communicator, Dave. And I never remember wincing at your grammar, even once!

Just remember to capitalize your proper nouns, unless you really did help your uncle jack off a horse.

I also suck at punctuation. Somebody once even told me that I'm doing it randomly It was many years ago and now I'm better but still no good.

And here I'm talking about my native Polish. Each language has its own rules a bit different from the others. As for English I have actually never seen the rules, doing everything by intuition.

One thing that is really important - always put a space after a dot. People will forgive you many things but not this one.

Ralf wrote: ↑Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:43 am I also suck at punctuation. Somebody once even told me that I'm doing it randomly It was many years ago and now I'm better but still no good.

Victor’s writing was a sort of code to deceive the enemy, with punctuation marks in unlikely places to confuse anyone who came too close to cracking the code. He watched Andrew counting the full stops in one sentence and said, ‘I put those in while I think about the next word. I like doing question marks better.’ He pointed out two or three specimens, independent question marks, without questions, They looked like curled feathers out of a pillow. One had a face.
‘Do you put a question mark in every sentence?’ asked Andrew.
‘Oh, yes. I know you don’t actually need them,’ said Victor, ‘but they're nice to do.’

Guesser wrote: ↑Sat Sep 15, 2018 3:34 pm

Victor’s writing was a sort of code to deceive the enemy . . .

Neat. What’s that from?

Ast A. Moore wrote: ↑Sat Sep 15, 2018 3:45 pm Neat. What’s that from?

5 internet points to the first person who recognises it

Guesser wrote: ↑Sat Sep 15, 2018 4:04 pm

Ast A. Moore wrote: ↑Sat Sep 15, 2018 3:45 pm Neat. What’s that from?

5 internet points to the first person who recognises it

Intriguing. Throw in two sheep and an ox, and I might consider taking a crack at it.

lister_of_smeg wrote: ↑Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:26 am Just remember to capitalize your proper nouns, unless you really did help your uncle jack off a horse.

Heh, nah, Uncle Jack always fulfilled his pedagogical duties, at least he did when he wasn't wanking off Mr Triggermane.

Guesser wrote: ↑Sat Sep 15, 2018 12:43 am

MatGubbins wrote: ↑Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:29 pm Do I use the ` (left of 1) or ' (between L and Return) as an apostrophe? I find ' (L and Return) easier to press.

Yes, the (typewriter) apostrophe key is there to be easy to use. There’s basically no reason to ever use the grave accent key unless you’re writing shell scripts or some forrin language

If you were feeling particularly clever (or typesetting a book) you’d use proper unicode apostrophes rather than typewriter apostrophes like I’ve done throughout this post just to show off

Yeah, it does look great.

"Weird Al" Yankovic....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Gv0H-vPoDc

It's not so much punctuation as completely wrong words that get on my nerves - people writing "I should of done that" instead of "I should have done that". It's the result of a chain of people only half-listening and repeating others without ever paying attention to reading or writing in English. And then there's the ones who think "specifically" has a silent 's'!

Anyway, good punctuation is the difference between knowing your sh*t and knowing you're sh*t.

'I was like basically going to just say that'!!!! People who use 'like' and 'basically' as filler words are just morons. People who also use 'literally' to pad out sentences are vapid cretins.

R-Tape wrote: ↑Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:00 pm ;

"The semicolon or semi colon is a punctuation mark that separates major sentence elements. A semicolon can be used between two closely related independent clauses, provided they are not already joined by a coordinating conjunction"

I beg your pardon?

Spud wrote: ↑Mon Sep 24, 2018 5:38 pm

R-Tape wrote: ↑Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:00 pm ;

"The semicolon or semi colon is a punctuation mark that separates major sentence elements. A semicolon can be used between two closely related independent clauses, provided they are not already joined by a coordinating conjunction"

I beg your pardon?

I’d use a butt-spice myself...

1024MAK wrote: ↑Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:00 pm

Spud wrote: ↑Mon Sep 24, 2018 5:38 pm "The semicolon or semi colon is a punctuation mark that separates major sentence elements. A semicolon can be used between two closely related independent clauses, provided they are not already joined by a coordinating conjunction"

I beg your pardon?

I’d use a butt-spice myself...

Baby, Sporty, Posh, Scary and Ginger... I don't recall a butt-spice.