Proposal: ZXDB marking in posts?

[R-Tape]

How many times have things been missed? Is any of this extra work necessary?

Also once the upload tool goes live, won't that replace change requests in the forum?

Definitely not. The upload tool is brilliant for file uploads, but terrible for fixes, removals and replacements (detailed here). I'm going to recommend keeping those to concise lists and threads.

The 'little bugs in the database' thread is a perfect example, that makes things very easy.

[Einar Saukas]

If @Einar Saukas is to be granted the powers of an admin or moderator, he should be designated as admin or moderator.

Good point. It would be misleading to give me admin/moderator powers without indicating it. But it would be misleading to credit me as admin/moderator when I wouldn't be administering or moderating...

It seems I'm opening a new can of worms!

[Ralf]

As a person who uploads some stuff to ZXDB from time to time I agree to everything which will make the process easier

Including editing my posts if it would be handy. I also have no problem with Einar becoming a moderator if required.

[Rorthron]

If @Einar Saukas is to be granted the powers of an admin or moderator, he should be designated as admin or moderator.

Good point. It would be misleading to give me admin/moderator powers without indicating it. But it would be misleading to credit me as admin/moderator when I wouldn't be administering or moderating...

It seems I'm opening a new can of worms!

You can be an admin without being a moderator. Different people on the team can have different roles.

But this is really one for PeterJ, R-Tape and Ivanzx.

[Juan F. Ramirez]

Why not create a new forum section instead of 'little bugs in the database'thread? Or use 'website' or 'ZXDB discussion' sections instead for this.

This section would include thread by thread every fault detected by users. Once detected and solved, the thread is closed.

I don't know if this is what Einar meant.

[1024MAK]

It should also be pointed out that:

1. There is a big difference between the roles and powers between administrators and moderators. Admin’s have much more power and access to much more information.
2. The area of control that moderators have can be across all of the forum (global) or restricted to certain sub-forums. If the moderator rights are restricted to certain sub-forums, they have no ability to edit, delete or move posts in areas outside their allotted sub-forums.
3. The actual powers that moderators have is determined by what the admin’s decide and select.
4. Both admin’s and moderators can see more information (than normal members) on members details and what has been reported or modified. Again there are differences between the information that admin’s and mod’s can access.

Expanding on what Juan said:

In terms of ease of updating, creating one or more new sub-forum looks the best way to go from my point of view. Each issue should be posted individually (with a meaningful title). Then it is easy for whoever is doing the updates to see if they have read the report (new post flag).

When they commence work on the issue, they can post a reply saying so. They can also use the bookmarks system to remember which issues they are working on.

When the issue is sorted, or a problem stops progress, they can reply giving the details. If/when the issue is sorted, they can use the “report post” facility to request that a moderator locks the thread. That then stops someone later from posting about a new issue in the same thread.

This system would be completely transparent to all members.

Shoot me down if this does not look like it is a workable system...

Mark

[Einar Saukas]

I will take a look in the phpBB control panel and see what the options are.

Since you will take a look into this... We already have a like/love button in every post, and this like/love icon can be customized in phpBB. I wouldn't want to sacrifice this functionality here, but perhaps there could be a second similar button, customized for ZXDB? And considering that new users would probably misunderstanding its purpose and may click everywhere, using it could be restricted to a group of users.

However I don't know if that's even possible, or how much work it would require. But if it worked this way, it would avoid the need to edit posts thus solve most of the concerns mentioned here.

[Einar Saukas]

I'd like a bit more time to think about this. If it's mainly me doing the collating, then I'm concerned it will create more work as I'll feel the pressure to get it marked quickly.

We could adopt the convention of marking posts only after the information is released in a new ZXDB update. This way nobody would feel disappointed about their posts not being marked immediately.

[Einar Saukas]

I should also mention that @Mike Davies is in discussion with @R-Tape and I about marking changes on the update form as completed too.

Good idea!

[PeterJ]

I will take a look in the phpBB control panel and see what the options are.

Since you will take a look into this... We already have a like/love button in every post, and this like/love icon can be customized in phpBB. I wouldn't want to sacrifice this functionality here, but perhaps there could be a second similar button, customized for ZXDB? And considering that new users would probably misunderstanding its purpose and may click everywhere, using it could be restricted to a group of users.

However I don't know if that's even possible, or how much work it would require. But if it worked this way, it would avoid the need to edit posts thus solve most of the concerns mentioned here.

Hi [mention]Einar Saukas[/mention]

The Like/Love button is a plugin. I will look to see if there is something similar for our purpose.

[Einar Saukas]

Since you will take a look into this... We already have a like/love button in every post, and this like/love icon can be customized in phpBB. I wouldn't want to sacrifice this functionality here, but perhaps there could be a second similar button, customized for ZXDB? And considering that new users would probably misunderstanding its purpose and may click everywhere, using it could be restricted to a group of users.

However I don't know if that's even possible, or how much work it would require. But if it worked this way, it would avoid the need to edit posts thus solve most of the concerns mentioned here.

Hi @Einar Saukas

The Like/Love button is a plugin. I will look to see if there is something similar for our purpose.

Thank you!

[Rorthron]

Expanding on what Juan said:

In terms of ease of updating, creating one or more new sub-forum looks the best way to go from my point of view. Each issue should be posted individually (with a meaningful title). Then it is easy for whoever is doing the updates to see if they have read the report (new post flag).

When they commence work on the issue, they can post a reply saying so. They can also use the bookmarks system to remember which issues they are working on.

When the issue is sorted, or a problem stops progress, they can reply giving the details.

To me this seems like the simplest solution, if you want to go down the path of tracking and recording changes that have been implemented. But it doesn't need a new subforum; the existing ZXDB section can be used.

[druellan]

@druellan, please say when things are missed, or announced as done but not. Sometimes they have been missed, sometimes they have been done, but a bug stops it showing on the site. This happened with Vallation128 for example: I uploaded inlays twice, as I couldn't see them, but it turned out a permissions flag stopped them appearing

Oh, it is already solved. Wasn't a compain, you guys are doing an awesome job, but just to point out that even when we follow the procedures, things can get messy, and everything that improves the communication is welcome.

[R-Tape]

Everyone should have noticed that ZXDB updates have not been happening as often lately, because both @R-Tape and myself have been extremely busy

As often as what? The last update was just over a week ago! More often than many previous months. Not all the logged changes were completed, but we won't have to wait long.

but when it's a long thread, posting replies to posts from several pages before, can be very confusing.

I don't agree—If you quote, the person gets flagged already. I struggle to imagine that most would bother to search back through a long thread looking for a 'done' flag.

In terms of ease of updating, creating one or more new sub-forum looks the best way to go from my point of view.

Why do we need to change anything? What is currently not working?

From my point of view, collating updates should go like this:

-Brand new games: announce in the Brand New Software thread (Ralf is the stalwart there ) and make publicly available so everyone can enjoy it immediately.*
-MIA, uMIA. Use the upload form, and announce so people can enjoy it. Include as much info as possible (preferably including screenshots), and a comment to make it clear why this should be added.
-Small fixes: use an active 'small bugs' thread in the ZXDB Discussion part of the forum. Be as concise as possible, and include as much relevant info as possible. That's what Ale, dru, 8bitAG, Juan and others are already doing.
-Bigger fixes, or fixes that need discussion: should have their own thread in ZXDB Discussion. Like that idiot that started the 'Maze Genre thread

Some of the above may appear via a sideways route, like email, something discovered in the 'Games' part of the forum, a news item from Andre, or a game author starts their own thread for their game (as I hope they will), or anywhere on the forum from a newcomer that doesn't know the ropes.

A list of details is announced at the same time as the update.

At the moment, I 'like' a post if I want the author to know I've seen it (unless I comment). I kind of like the idea of a 'ZXDB flag' similar to the 'like' button, but my concern is that it ends up like a booking-out form for a shed key—never, rarely, sometimes, or always used, depending on the phase of the moon.

I don't think we need to lock threads when the action is completed either. Something new may crop up and be relevant.

Basically—IMO don't change anything!

* If you want to be especially helpful then use the upload form for files and screenshots, but bear in mind that they may have already been done, or already uploaded (don't let that discourage you, but it may not be 'your' screenshot that you see.. The important part is reporting the news though.

[Einar Saukas]

I kind of like the idea of a 'ZXDB flag' similar to the 'like' button, but my concern is that it ends up like a booking-out form for a shed key—never, rarely, sometimes, or always used, depending on the phase of the moon.

I understand your point, and I'm not saying there's anything wrong with the current process. It's just that this flag would help a lot to ensure we didn't miss anything, especially in threads like this and this.

[Vampyre]

Don't know if I'm missing something here but wouldn't a ZXDB Trello board be an ideal solution? It's free, can limit access if you wish (or just make it publicly accessible to everyone) and it's simply a case of each change request gets its own card. Once the request is complete move it from a Request List into a Completed List.

[hikoki]

Another option could be to host a bug tracker like mantisbt.org
Dunno if mantis can be integrated into phpbb, otherwise updates could be managed in a separate site.

slightly off-topic, this simple tool is practical and free, you just need a google sheet and follow these steps
https://support.awesome-table.com/hc/en ... es-Cabinet
make a subfolder for every title and every time you add files, changes are reflected automatically
permissions to a number of people can be assigned so they access this folder

[Einar Saukas]

Don't know if I'm missing something here but wouldn't a ZXDB Trello board be an ideal solution? It's free, can limit access if you wish (or just make it publicly accessible to everyone) and it's simply a case of each change request gets its own card. Once the request is complete move it from a Request List into a Completed List.

Technically that's a good solution. However in practice, if we required users to create a new Trello account and figure out how to use it properly, before they can post a bug report, I bet many people would give up reporting anything.

I agree with R-Tape that there's nothing really wrong with the current system. We shouldn't try to fix something that's not broken. Therefore we should only try to improve it as long as it doesn't impact users.

Taking into account everyone's feedback, I'm now convinced the only reasonable option would be a new like/love button for ZXDB. If that's not viable, then let's just keep the current process...

[4thRock]

For me the simple solution would be use human readable marking and edit posts.

For example:
[updated ]
[duplicate of post #xxx ]

Might even work with forum searches, and no code change required.

I see no problem with having a moderator that's only active in certain topics / sub-topics, and only adds those tags.