Little bugs in the database 2

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druellan
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Re: Little bugs in the database 2

Post by druellan » Sat Jul 27, 2019 12:07 pm

Einar Saukas wrote:
Fri Jul 26, 2019 4:28 pm
Whenever you find a game that says (c)1987 but it was released later, it's almost certain they intended to release it in 1987 but it took longer than expected for the actual release.
Something that I also noticed and seems confusing is the copyright owner vs the publisher. For example, on Virgin Mastertronic games, VM is the copyright holder, but the games are usually published by Virgin Games. I was thinking on having an extra field: copyright label and copyright year, but, of course, if we do that, we need to populate this on the database, that can be a challenge.
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Re: Little bugs in the database 2

Post by druellan » Sat Jul 27, 2019 11:54 pm

StooB wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 11:37 am
Convoy

F. David Thorpe (UK) is credited for the loading screen for this, but according to the inlay, he wrote the program too.
This is wonderful, great job spotting this StooB!!
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Re: Little bugs in the database 2

Post by 8BitAG » Tue Jul 30, 2019 9:14 am

Referencing this advert from Adventure Probe (Volume 1 Issue 10 March 1987)...
Image

The following games should have a first publication date of at least 1986, under the publisher name 'Anthony Collins' [this release pre-dates Pegasus Software/The Guild]

Nythyhel
https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/index.p ... 96&id=6752

Miami Mice [Note: this title was Quilled]
https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/index.p ... 6&id=27701

Theseus ***
https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/index.p ... 96&id=7094

Teacher Trouble ***
https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/index.p ... 6&id=27701

*** NOTE: Both Theseus and Teacher Trouble were QUILLed games in these 1986 releases, before being recoded as PAWed games for the later releases by The Guild/Zenobi etc. The Quilled versions seem to be MIA.

I don't think that we have yet decided on a firm line for whether we combine games as a single entry, even if completely different versions exist.

There are both instances where we do... e,g. Quest for the Golden Eggcup

and where we don't!

...e.g. Federation / Quann Tulla

Presumably, the use of a different title would be a deciding factor?
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Re: Little bugs in the database 2

Post by moroz1999 » Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:10 am

https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/index.p ... el_id=1333
http://speccy.info/Ascendancy - it's a group from Belarus, Grodno. The full name is Ascendancy Creative Labs.
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Re: Little bugs in the database 2

Post by moroz1999 » Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:11 am

https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/index.p ... el_id=6412
Izhevsk is not a publisher, Izhevsk is a city in Russia.
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Einar Saukas
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Re: Little bugs in the database 2

Post by Einar Saukas » Sat Aug 03, 2019 1:44 pm

druellan wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 12:07 pm
Einar Saukas wrote:
Fri Jul 26, 2019 4:28 pm
Whenever you find a game that says (c)1987 but it was released later, it's almost certain they intended to release it in 1987 but it took longer than expected for the actual release.
Something that I also noticed and seems confusing is the copyright owner vs the publisher. For example, on Virgin Mastertronic games, VM is the copyright holder, but the games are usually published by Virgin Games. I was thinking on having an extra field: copyright label and copyright year, but, of course, if we do that, we need to populate this on the database, that can be a challenge.
It was common practice for publishers to have multiple labels. One for top games, other for budget titles, another for re-releases, sometimes yet another for adventures, etc. Then it made more sense to keep all copyrights in the main company, so if it decided later to close a subsidiary, it wouldn't have to move all existing copyrights somewhere else. Or perhaps all those labels were not real companies, just different brands belonging to a single company.

ZXDB already stores information about labels that belong to other labels. I think that's enough, we don't need to keep track of copyrights separately. If a certain game was published by label A that belongs to B, someone would need to talk about any copyright issues with B anyway, regardless if the game copyright was assigned to A or B.
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Re: Little bugs in the database 2

Post by druellan » Sat Aug 03, 2019 6:26 pm

Einar Saukas wrote:
Sat Aug 03, 2019 1:44 pm
ZXDB already stores information about labels that belong to other labels. I think that's enough, we don't need to keep track of copyrights separately. If a certain game was published by label A that belongs to B, someone would need to talk about any copyright issues with B anyway, regardless if the game copyright was assigned to A or B.
Yes, but that information is not timestamped, for example currently on ZXDB, the owner of Virgin Games is Titus, since Titus bought Virgin Interactive on the 2000. There is no reference that, on the '80, Virgin Games was part of Virgin Mastertronic.
Just to be clear, my concern is more towards the information displayed on SC, specially since we are starting to deviate from other databases like WOS or MobyGames, that tend to list the copyright owner, not the publisher.
Again, not sure if this information is worth to be preserved, I don't like to add new fields that later we need to populate on 30.000+ entries, but it is kind of bothering me, since I myself find fascinating to discover that some labels I remember from back in the date, were in fact "fantasy" labels owned by another company.
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Re: Little bugs in the database 2

Post by Einar Saukas » Sun Aug 04, 2019 4:29 am

druellan wrote:
Sat Aug 03, 2019 6:26 pm
Einar Saukas wrote:
Sat Aug 03, 2019 1:44 pm
ZXDB already stores information about labels that belong to other labels. I think that's enough, we don't need to keep track of copyrights separately. If a certain game was published by label A that belongs to B, someone would need to talk about any copyright issues with B anyway, regardless if the game copyright was assigned to A or B.
Yes, but that information is not timestamped, for example currently on ZXDB, the owner of Virgin Games is Titus, since Titus bought Virgin Interactive on the 2000. There is no reference that, on the '80, Virgin Games was part of Virgin Mastertronic.
But it's because this information (imported from Martijn's WoS) isn't detailed enough. It simply says all these companies are owned by Titus.

I suggest changing this information as follows:
  • "Virgin Games Ltd" became "Virgin Mastertronic Ltd"
  • "Mastertronic Ltd" owned by "Virgin Mastertronic Ltd"
  • "Virgin Mastertronic Ltd" owned by Titus
This way, the information should be more accurate. Agreed?
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Re: Little bugs in the database 2

Post by zx81 » Sun Aug 04, 2019 11:44 am

Strictly speaking this isn't a bug, but Black Lamp features Rainbow Graphics and isn't listed so.
✓ Reviewed
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Re: Little bugs in the database 2

Post by StooB » Sun Aug 04, 2019 11:51 am

Einar Saukas wrote:
Sun Aug 04, 2019 4:29 am

But it's because this information (imported from Martijn's WoS) isn't detailed enough. It simply says all these companies are owned by Titus.

I suggest changing this information as follows:
  • "Virgin Games Ltd" became "Virgin Mastertronic Ltd"
  • "Mastertronic Ltd" owned by "Virgin Mastertronic Ltd"
  • "Virgin Mastertronic Ltd" owned by Titus
This way, the information should be more accurate. Agreed?
Virgin Games was part of Virgin Mastertronic until Sega (not Titus) bought the Mastertronic part of the company, and then they continued being Virgin Games independently.

The current system can't define Virgin Games as only being a part of Virgin Mastertronic from 1988-91.

I think there's only two ways to solve this:
1. add extra fields to every single release - like 'owner', 'label'
2. treat the titles as joint publications, so for Silkworm the original would be published by Virgin Games and Virgin Mastertronic, while the Tronix re-release would be published by Tronix and Virgin Games
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