Spectrum Computing

Lethargeek wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 9:07 am but IIRC Rex demo isn't actually playable, it's just an animation (~rzx)

Right, I've loaded up a .tzx of YS Smash Tape 10 to check my memory isn't cheating me. I'm not great at Rex, but so far I've decided to define keys (not a fan of joysticks). It's very much playable! And I'm still crap at it!

Of particular interest is this explainer as you start the demo:

"THIS IS A MIXTURE OF BACKGROUNDS FROM LOAD TWO AND ENEMIES FROM LOAD ONE WITH THE FOURTH WEAPON SYSTEM"

So it would seem that it's not quite content exclusive to the demo, just an edited 'remix' of sorts, of the full game?

1. Ikari Warriors
2. Rasputin
3. Robocop

The demo of Ikari Warriors had a tank which you could drive for half the level. Tanks were rare and not as much fun in the actual game. The demo is therefore better than the game, IMHO.

Rasputin was the first playable demo that I saw. Me and my friend laughed with mirth that the idiots that make the magazine had accidentally included the full game on the tape instead of just screenshots.

And the robocop demo was incredible.

PeteProdge wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 8:50 am Ironically enough, it has been!

My first thought was to throw in every playable demo from a YS/Crash/SU covertape, but that - at 138 entries - goes above the phpBB poll limits, so I've broken it into full price and budget. And yeah, it is still quite huge on the full price side. I could break it down into YS, Crash and SU, but feels tooclose to the Covertape Wars polls.

The big problem I'm gonna run into is when I hit the Re-released Full Price Games category, as that's the biggest of them all. My working out has it standing at 238 entries, so that needs to be broken down somehow.

Randomly or alphabetically order them, run 4 polls, then a final with the winners of the 4.

Mpk wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 10:27 am Randomly or alphabetically order them, run 4 polls, then a final with the winners of the 4.

I've never been keen on the 'World cup tournament' way of finding a winner. I mean, it does usually lead to a worthy winner, but it also has a strong probability that mediocre entries get towards the top.

My current idea is to do a preliminary poll where, instead of the usual radio button, users get something like two or three (or even four or five) checkbox votes to indicate their favourites. Then I can filter out the non-voted games to get to an amount that fits the phpBB voting option threshold. I've done something like this before, for 'the best game by Zenobi Software', as that software brand had more games than the voting option threshold.

PeteProdge wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 9:35 am Right, I've loaded up a .tzx of YS Smash Tape 10 to check my memory isn't cheating me. I'm not great at Rex, but so far I've decided to define keys (not a fan of joysticks). It's very much playable! And I'm still crap at it!

oh, so it's different from RexDemo.tap i see

(nvm, found it)

PeteProdge wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 10:51 am I've never been keen on the 'World cup tournament' way of finding a winner. I mean, it does usually lead to a worthy winner, but it also has a strong probability that mediocre entries get towards the top.

My current idea is to do a preliminary poll where, instead of the usual radio button, users get something like two or three (or even four or five) checkbox votes to indicate their favourites. Then I can filter out the non-voted games to get to an amount that fits the phpBB voting option threshold. I've done something like this before, for 'the best game by Zenobi Software', as that software brand had more games than the voting option threshold.

As you wish. I find that when the list is so long I lose track. By the time I get to the bottom, I've forgotten what's at the top.

Lethargeek wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 10:57 am oh, so it's different from RexDemo.tap i see
but how to find all those covertape versions here to download?
is there a way to search for a specific title?

Back when I was doing the Covertape Wars polls, I relied on PDFs of all the major three UK Speccy magazines (thanks to archive.org) really helped, plus TOSEC's ZX Spectrum collection of TZXs has a folder of covertapes, and of course this website on various entries would list the entire series of a magazine's covertapes.

Mpk wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 11:00 am As you wish. I find that when the list is so long I lose track. By the time I get to the bottom, I've forgotten what's at the top.

I feel that way with my own polls which are very very long, such as this one.

The way I mustered up my choices for this one was have Notepad open in a window and I scrolled through my first post here, typing the names of any demo I thought were pretty damned good. That way I narrowed it down to about eight entries and consequently, choosing a top three was quite easy.

Lethargeek wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 10:57 am oh, so it's different from RexDemo.tap i see

Never heard of that file. But the non-interactive "demo" of Rex is, if I understand correctly, side A of the official release.

Side B is the game, but I wouldn't call side A a demo.

For everyone else, the demo we're talking here is a different one.

PeteProdge wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 9:35 am Of particular interest is this explainer as you start the demo:

"THIS IS A MIXTURE OF BACKGROUNDS FROM LOAD TWO AND ENEMIES FROM LOAD ONE WITH THE FOURTH WEAPON SYSTEM"

So it would seem that it's not quite content exclusive to the demo, just an edited 'remix' of sorts, of the full game?

It's your poll, so you get to define your categories.

My suggestion is that, if you have very specific definitions for your categories, then you'll have to play and categorise the games yourself. Because while I can play the games and give my opinions on them, I can't never be as specific as you are.

My personal opinion is that the Rex Demo on the cover tape feels completely different than the real levels, and therefore they are different.

PS. You should try out the Stormlord Demo too, because for me that's definitely completely different than the real game. But your miles might vary.

Timmy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 11:19 am My suggestion is that, if you have very specific definitions for your categories, then you'll have to play and categorise the games yourself. Because while I can play the games and give my opinions on them, I can't never be as specific as you are.

The problem is that... I'm not really a good games player. There are a few Speccy games I can absolutely ace, but these are in the single digits. I fail at most!

It looks like I'd have to resort to an .rzx of any full game, and then POKEs of playable demos - which aren't always likely to be working with playable demos.

Timmy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 11:19 amMy personal opinion is that the Rex Demo on the cover tape feels completely different than the real levels, and therefore they are different.

Yeah, I feel that such a situation makes it not a true playable demo, and deserves the 'special edition' tag, which first came about from items like Dan Dare II: SU Edition and Dizzy 3 And A Half.

Timmy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 11:19 am PS. You should try out the Stormlord Demo too, because for me that's definitely completely different than the real game. But your miles might vary.

I'll tentatively reassign that to 'Special Edition, etc' status.

I'll still let this poll go ahead, but will do more thorough investigation towards the end of this series and then probably re-run it! Thanks!

PeteProdge wrote: ↑Sun Apr 07, 2024 7:56 am rolling demo - ie: unplayable!

the shadow of the beast also belongs to this category, she's not playable

goodboy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 5:30 pm the shadow of the beast also belongs to this category, she's not playable

Oops! You are indeed right!

No wonder I'll re-run this poll at a later date. Consider this a dress rehearsal!

goodboy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 08, 2024 5:30 pm the shadow of the beast also belongs to this category, she's not playable

Some would say the same of the final game....

1. Hero Quest
2. Robocop
3. TMNT - NES conversion

I voted for Ikari Warriors. I played that demo through a bunch of times but oddly didn't really enjoy the full game.

I don't recall playing many demos. I probably did play them, I just don't remember! I'm pretty sure I didn't come across any demo on that list that inspired me to rush out and buy the game though!
I don't see R-Type on the list though - was that a C+VG Spectrum/C64 dual tape? I can't remember if I played it or not; I got the real game as soon as it was available.

I do remember Rasputin, from that first ever Your Sinclair. It was great to get that playable tape but the game itself was made too hard by the awkward controls. Since I couldn't easily beat the few screens that were in the demo, I didn't think I'd get far with the real thing! I remember Rex looked good but was just too slow. I seem to remember Athena had a dicky loader and wasn't much fun really. And Power Drift, which I had fun playing, but it was a poor copy of what was an immensely powerful arcade game. I think I played it more hoping it would get better!

Of them all, I seem to remember Hotshot was the most fun, and let you play quite a bit without bothering you to buy the full game. Which I didn't. I just played the demo! I suspect there wasn't really that much more to see as the AI opponent was fairly competent, and there didn't seem to be much variation even possible in the formula.

Joefish wrote: ↑Tue Apr 09, 2024 11:59 am I don't see R-Type on the list though - was that a C+VG Spectrum/C64 dual tape? I can't remember if I played it or not; I got the real game as soon as it was available.

Yes, it was a C&VG covertape, and the Commodore 64 demo is really quite different to the game that was eventually released. As I'm culling the demos from YS, Crash and SU, it's why I'm not including covertapes from C&VG, ACE, Microhobby or anything else.

I voted for Robocop. It had an exclusive feature that wasn’t found in the final release. You could make the falling bad guys bounce on your bullets.

1 Lemmings
2 Midnight Resistance
3 The Addams Family

Right then, I stand by my conclusion that this is a flawed poll and yes, I'll re-run this later in the year, but for now, it's been an interesting 'dress rehearsal' anyway, and the winner of this is one of the entries that legitimately meets the criteria. That being...

Ikari Warriors as the winner, with four votes!

In joint second place: The Bard's Tale; Chase HQ and Robocop - three votes each. (And all of them are viable.)

In joint third place: Hero Quest; Lemmings; Midnight Resistance and Rex - two votes each. (Apart from Rex, all viable.)

In joint fourth place, with one vote each: Astroball; Athena; Atomic Robo-Kid (an MIA game!); Batman: The Movie; Dominator; Hotshot; Mad Mix Game; Savage; Skate Crazy; Space Crusade and Xenon. (All viable.)

Ikari Warriors also tops the proportional results:

Ikari Warriors (playable demo) by Elite 8
Cybernoid II: The Revenge (playable demo) by Hewson 6 (not viable though!)
Lemmings (playable demo) by Psygnosis 6
Hero Quest (playable demo) by Gremlin 5
Midnight Resistance (playable demo) by Ocean 5
Rasputin (playable demo) by Firebird 5
Bard's Tale, The (playable demo) by Electronic Arts 3
Dark Side (playable demo) by Incentive 3
Dominator (playable demo) by System 3 3
Rex (playable demo) by Martech 3 (not viable though!)
Robocop (playable demo) by Ocean 3
Skate Or Die (playable demo) by Electronic Arts 3
Armalyte (playable demo) by Thalamus 2
Avalanche (playable demo) by CCS 2
Last Ninja 2 (playable demo) by System 3 2
Mad Mix Game (playable demo) by Topo Soft 2
Space Crusade (playable demo) by Gremlin 2
Addams Family, The (playable demo) by Ocean 1
Atomic Robo-Kid (playable demo) by Activision 1
Ivan 'Ironman' Stewart's Super Off Road (playable demo) by Virgin Games 1
Mystical (playable demo) by Infogrames 1
Skate Crazy (playable demo) by Gremlin 1
Teenage Mutant Hero Turtles (NES game conversion) (playable demo) by Image Works 1
Xenon (playable demo) by Melbourne House 1