Little bugs in the database 3

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druellan
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by druellan »

Pogo (1983)

was released in 1984. Reviews range from May to August 1984, there are no adverts for it until April 1984. Personal Computer News lists it as a new release in their 14th April edition (nb: the [url=https://spectrumcom uting.co.uk/mag.php?issue_id=4715&page=7]page link[/url] doesn't work for this, but the viewer link does)
Ocean was not particularly active on magazines prior to 1984, but I can confirm there is no information I can find about POGO before 1984. The 1983 figure was probably extracted from the copyright notice on the instructions, that is by the author, not Ocean. The author was also active in Ocean around 1984.

Also, Bob Wakelin is the author of the inlay. Source: signature.
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druellan
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by druellan »

Galaxian (1984)
Reviewed in April 1985, year of release should be 1985.
Ms Pac-Man (1984)
The Your Spectrum review of September 1984 is of Pac-Man, not Ms Pac-Man.
The other reviews are from March and April 1985, so the year of release should be 1985.
I'll probably leave this two unchanged for now. There are some AtariSoft adverts from 1983 stating "out now!" for those titles. Might be the case they dropped the release for Christmas, but let's roll with this.
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by druellan »

StooB wrote: Thu Jun 11, 2020 12:12 pm N.O.M.A.D. (1985)
Cosmic Wartoad (1985)
Zoids (1985)
Benny Hill's Madcap Chase (1985)

are all 1986 releases, listed in the "This Week" section in Popular Computer Weekly 9th-15th January 1986 here and here.
Oh, boy! :lol: Let's see

NOMAD. No information about the game prior to January 1986, same for the Spanish release. First advert I can find on Sinclair User 46 (1986), and a full page one! So, seems like a big release.
Comsmic Wartoad. No information about the game prior to 1986. Spanish version advertised for the first time on January 1986.
Zoids. There are some ads for November 1985, probably for christmas. I prefer to leave this one alone for now.
Benny Hill. First Spanish review, April 1986. First english review April 1986.
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druellan
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by druellan »

StooB wrote: Wed Jun 24, 2020 11:47 am "Again Again" is still listed as a Grandslam label when it's an Alternative one.
Looking at the database, we have Again Again listed as:
Image

But looking at the adverts, it says that Again Again logo is trademark of Tiger Developments.
Image

So, instead of "from Tiger Developments" and "owned by Grandslam" perhaps should be only "Owned by Tiger Development"?
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by StooB »

druellan wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:45 pm
StooB wrote: Wed Jun 24, 2020 11:47 am "Again Again" is still listed as a Grandslam label when it's an Alternative one.
Looking at the database, we have Again Again listed as:
Image

But looking at the adverts, it says that Again Again logo is trademark of Tiger Developments.
Image

So, instead of "from Tiger Developments" and "owned by Grandslam" perhaps should be only "Owned by Tiger Development"?
The magazine references all indicate that Again Again is an Alternative label (here, here and here) and the address given for Tiger Developments on the adverts is the same as Alternative Software.

But in 1992, the Again Again label re-appears on a budget re-release of Spitfire 40 + Strike Force Harrier whose inlay is completely Alternative with no mention of Tiger. Tiger Developments seem to disappear after 1989.

So:
Tiger Developments should be owned by Alternative
and
Again Again should be founded by Tiger Developments and owned by Alternative.

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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by druellan »

Excellent!
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Einar Saukas
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by Einar Saukas »

StooB wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 3:02 pmTujad (1986)

Original publisher should be Orpheus Ltd, who advertised it in 1985.

Home Computing Weekly said it was finished and "out now" for £8.95 in the week beginning 17th September 1985, and Popular Computing Weekly listed it as a new release in the week beginning 12th September 1985.

Crash reported in June 1986 that Orpheus wouldn't be releasing it themselves.
Does it mean Orpheus developed the game and planned to release it in 1985, but they didn't? I assume they notified publications in advance about their upcoming release dates, but then cancelled it.

That's how I'm interpreting the news from Crash. In this case, original publication by Ariolasoft in 1986 would be correct.
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Einar Saukas
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by Einar Saukas »

StooB wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 3:37 pm Blue Max

The PCW review is for Blue Max 2001 on the Commodore 64.
This is tricky.

The article explicitly says "Spectrum 48K".

Also the reviewer seem to believe it's the Spectrum version. When writing about the sequel for a popular game from the same platform, it's more natural to assume most readers were already familiar with the original game. Even if that's not the case, it still sounds much better than assuming player's ignorance by default. Therefore a reviewer would most probably write something like "Blue Max 2001 is the sequel to the popular and successful Blue Max". Instead, the reviewer assumed the opposite, implicitly meaning something similar to "Blue Max 2001 is the sequel to Blue Max, a title you probably never heard of, but it's a popular and successful title that any C64 would know".

However Blue Max 2001 was never released for the Spectrum. So how can we explain it?

Blue Max for C64 was released in 1983. Both Blue Max 2001 for C64, and Blue Max for Spectrum, were released about the same time in 1984. Perhaps the magazine intended to write about the Spectrum version but didn't receive it on time, so they assumed it would be nearly identical to the new C64 version and wrote accordingly. Perhaps they even published the low quality screenshot on purpose (it's much worse than other screenshots from the same issue) so it's not possible to distinguish the platform.

Or perhaps the magazine simply wrote "Spectrum 48K" by mistake. Based on this wrong information, the reviewer tried to write accordingly, without ever playing the game. It would explain the evaluation "the game is fine but not a classic", it's the kind of generic sentence someone says when pretending to know a game they don't...

Or perhaps I'm overthinking it :)
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by druellan »

I don't remember my resolution about this report, but I think I decided to call it a print error, since the image above does not seems to be from a ZX Spectrum computer.
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Einar Saukas
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by Einar Saukas »

druellan wrote: Fri Dec 18, 2020 1:09 am I don't remember my resolution about this report, but I think I decided to call it a print error, since the image above does not seems to be from a ZX Spectrum computer.
The screenshot is certainly from the C64 version, but there are these other discrepancies that I pointed out.

Instead of removing this review, perhaps we could add a note such as:

"Curiously the Spectrum review at PCW describes instead its sequel Blue Max 2001 for the Commodore 64."
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by StooB »

Einar Saukas wrote: Thu Dec 17, 2020 11:20 pm
StooB wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 3:02 pmTujad (1986)

Original publisher should be Orpheus Ltd, who advertised it in 1985.

Home Computing Weekly said it was finished and "out now" for £8.95 in the week beginning 17th September 1985, and Popular Computing Weekly listed it as a new release in the week beginning 12th September 1985.

Crash reported in June 1986 that Orpheus wouldn't be releasing it themselves.
Does it mean Orpheus developed the game and planned to release it in 1985, but they didn't? I assume they notified publications in advance about their upcoming release dates, but then cancelled it.

That's how I'm interpreting the news from Crash. In this case, original publication by Ariolasoft in 1986 would be correct.
So for consistency, Inspector Gadget, Beach Volley and Vampire's Empire should have have original publishers as Erbe, Erbe and Dro Soft rather than Melbourne House, Ocean and Gremlin?
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druellan
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by druellan »

Einar Saukas wrote: Fri Dec 18, 2020 5:38 am The screenshot is certainly from the C64 version, but there are these other discrepancies that I pointed out.

Instead of removing this review, perhaps we could add a note such as:

"Curiously the Spectrum review at PCW describes instead its sequel Blue Max 2001 for the Commodore 64."
I did the exercise of reading it as a pure C64 title and I think it is consistent, but I like the idea of keeping it with a note, enriches the database and also is future proof in case anyone finds this review again and wonders why is not in the database.
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by StooB »

Einar Saukas wrote: Thu Dec 17, 2020 11:49 pm Blue Max for C64 was released in 1983. Both Blue Max 2001 for C64, and Blue Max for Spectrum, were released about the same time in 1984. Perhaps the magazine intended to write about the Spectrum version but didn't receive it on time

The same magazine lists Blue Max 2001 as a new entry in the Atari charts for that week so it may well be a review of that version.
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Einar Saukas
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by Einar Saukas »

StooB wrote: Fri Dec 18, 2020 8:06 am
Einar Saukas wrote: Thu Dec 17, 2020 11:20 pm Does it mean Orpheus developed the game and planned to release it in 1985, but they didn't? I assume they notified publications in advance about their upcoming release dates, but then cancelled it.

That's how I'm interpreting the news from Crash. In this case, original publication by Ariolasoft in 1986 would be correct.
So for consistency, Inspector Gadget, Beach Volley and Vampire's Empire should have have original publishers as Erbe, Erbe and Dro Soft rather than Melbourne House, Ocean and Gremlin?
Can you please explain what you mean?

It seems Orpheus announced they were going to publish Tujad but they never did. Therefore Orpheus cannot be the original publisher of Tujad.

What's the relation with the other games you mentioned?
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by StooB »

Einar Saukas wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 2:39 pm
StooB wrote: Fri Dec 18, 2020 8:06 am So for consistency, Inspector Gadget, Beach Volley and Vampire's Empire should have have original publishers as Erbe, Erbe and Dro Soft rather than Melbourne House, Ocean and Gremlin?
Can you please explain what you mean?

It seems Orpheus announced they were going to publish Tujad but they never did. Therefore Orpheus cannot be the original publisher of Tujad.

What's the relation with the other games you mentioned?
It's the same situation:
- Inspector Gadget was never released by Melbourne House but it has an original publisher of Melbourne House.
- Beach Volley was never released by Ocean but it has an original publisher of Ocean.
- Vampire's Empire was never released by Gremlin but it has an original publisher of Gremlin.
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Einar Saukas
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Re: Little bugs in the database 3

Post by Einar Saukas »

StooB wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 3:41 pm It's the same situation:
- Inspector Gadget was never released by Melbourne House but it has an original publisher of Melbourne House.
- Beach Volley was never released by Ocean but it has an original publisher of Ocean.
- Vampire's Empire was never released by Gremlin but it has an original publisher of Gremlin.
Oh, I see!

Yes, this information needs to be fixed.

If these companies developed the game but didn't publish it, they should be marked as developers instead of publishers.

Or if these companies neither develop or publish the game, just intended to publish it but never did, then they shouldn't be marked as original publishers either. Instead it's better to indicate the company that actually published it first, as the original publisher, and just have a note about the intended publisher.

The only exception we make to this rule is when a game was never released. In this case, it won't be misleading to have the intended publisher marked as original publisher, since there will be a big "never released" mark right above it. The rationale here is that, when listing games by Ultimate, it makes sense to see Mire Mare in this list, although marked as "never released". But when listing games by Melbourne House, we shouldn't have Inspector Gadget in this list, since this is a game published by other companies but never published by Melbourne House.
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