Games on itch.io - how much are you prepared to pay?

[presh]

I'm looking to polish up some of my stuff an pop it on itch.io

As someone who does it "for the love", I'm not too bothered about trying to make a ton of money... but with the recent energy rises (my monthly payments went up 72% yesterday ) and inflation / cost of living crisis etc, any extra money will be very much appreciated right now!!

I put Rival Gangs up with a "pay as you feel / free" price point, as I was mostly using itch to keep track of downloads. I'm overwhelmed that it has now reached over 1500 downloads - but I won't be quitting the day job any time soon, as it has only generated a total of $57.85 in revenue!

So I'm interested to know what kind of price point you folks would generally pay for a Speccy game?

Personally, I'm happy to part with £2.99-£3.99 without batting an eyelid. I can easily bung that much into arcade machines for less than 20 minutes of play, and I'm likely to spend more time than that playing a game I've paid for & downloaded, so it's a no-brainer to me. It's also the classic budget game price for back in the day, except the full amount(ish) goes to the developer, and it's cheaper in real terms than back then due to inflation/wage rises, so seems like a win-win.

But I also understand it's a bit of a punt for potential buyers, as it could be crap and with the aforementioned cost of living crisis in full swing, people are no doubt tightening their belts, even for little luxuries like cheap indie retro games.

I'm toying with the idea of putting up free playable demo versions, much like those which adorned magazine cover tapes way back when.

Anyway I'm keen to hear buyers views and developers experiences of buying/selling. It'd be nice to scrape a few £ together but I don't want to put people off... it's a tough one!

[PeterJ]

@presh,

Agreed that £2.99-£3.99 is around the right figure for a download. It's quite nice to have extras like wallpaper or instructions in PDF format. You can easily pay the same on a coffee!

I'm happy to.psy more, but would probably look for a playable demo first, or good feedback here.

Our gas and electric went up from £120 to £260!

[cha05e90]

Monitoring my own activity on itch.io, I conclude that the price range 2.99 - 3.99 GBP is a no-brainer, while (i.e.) beginning at 8.99 upwards I often do not hit the download/pay button immediately.

[dfzx]

The bottom line is that very few people pay for Spectrum games these days. Spectrum gamers are a niche market, and those who will pay for a new game is a niche within the niche. There are so many thousands of games to explore for free...

If you want to turn a few quid I think you did everything right: creating a development thread here, showing the effort and expertise that was going into it, answering people's queries. It was a pleasure to follow it, and the quality of what you've produced is exceptional.

To make money I'd have suggested a playable demo and a compulsory charge for the final version. Presumably you know what people were prepared to pay? 1,500 downloads and $57.85 means about 4c each on average, but what was the average payment for those who paid more than zero? Other people might find that a useful metric if you wanted to share it.

[PeterJ]

Sorry to interrupt the thread.

@presh,

Please can you check the email on your account. The server keeps bouncing back forum notifications to you.

Thanks

[AndyC]

Honestly, probably not a lot if anything. I will try out new Speccy games if they look interesting enough and I have the time but I rarely have much opportunity to get to drawn into them so it's not really going to be worth spending money on

As it is I also have queues of games I've bought on GoG, Xbox Live or Switch Online to play. I only just got round to playing Resident Evil Village last weekend, after buying it in November and I've got Witcher 3 for the Switch, given to me as a birthday gift in January, that is yet unopened.

I know that's probably not what developers want to hear, but I think it's best to be realistic about these things. As a developer myself, I'd love to believe there was some way to turn a real profit from a love of retro gaming, but I think that's really the province of streamers/YouTube channels and even then I don't imagine many make enough to really make a difference.

[Morkin]

Honestly, probably not a lot if anything. I will try out new Speccy games if they look interesting enough and I have the time but I rarely have much opportunity to get to drawn into them so it's not really going to be worth spending money on

As it is I also have queues of games I've bought on GoG, Xbox Live or Switch Online to play. I only just got round to playing Resident Evil Village last weekend, after buying it in November and I've got Witcher 3 for the Switch, given to me as a birthday gift in January, that is yet unopened.

I know that's probably not what developers want to hear, but I think it's best to be realistic about these things. As a developer myself, I'd love to believe there was some way to turn a real profit from a love of retro gaming, but I think that's really the province of streamers/YouTube channels and even then I don't imagine many make enough to really make a difference.

I'm in this exact camp as well I'm afraid... I've bought the odd new Speccy game on real media (tape) as a physical item, but haven't played a single Speccy game whose download wasn't free (sorry!).

I completely understand that the developer has the right to charge for download of their games if they want to though.

@AndyC good luck with Witcher 3, that's probably not going to do your game backlog much good

[Joefish]

It'd be nice to get some extra income, but I always think the returns I could get for even a popular game would be so ludicrously small compared to the time and effort I had to put in it would just end up being a disappointment! Though I've never tracked numbers of downloads on anything so I wouldn't know what I'm missing...

A free demo is always a good model, though as has been mentioned, a lot of people are likely to just play the demo and move on; people who wouldn't invest much more time playing a full game anyway. The trick is finding the right balance of letting someone experience the gameplay but cutting them off if they want more. Somewhere between little more than a rolling video, and having a whole challenging level of the game. Or promoting the full version without spamming them to death. Perhaps the solution there is a custom demo level that shows off features of the final game, without actually letting you complete anything significant.

There's a market for actual tape releases, though that's limited too.

I'd pay a few quid for download games if they reviewed well. I prefer more short-term experiences or arcadey games. Open-world is interesting though I'm not sure I'd spend a lot of time playing a Speccy game like that. I'd love to develop something like it, but I'd be thinking of adventure type games you could play through in one sitting once you know what you're doing, rather than trying to reproduce the 40+ hour levelling-up style of modern games.

And frankly I'd rather see £2 or £3 listed than that silly '£x.99' pricing any day of the week!

[presh]

Sorry to interrupt the thread.

@presh,

Please can you check the email on your account. The server keeps bouncing back forum notifications to you.

Thanks

Odd, I've been receiving PM notifications fine. I've changed it anyway! See if this one behaves...

[catmeows]

Well, I'm that kind of horrible person who almost never pay on itch.io.
Said that, Case of missing swan is probably one of the few new ZX games I would pay for.
Usually, I compare game price to cinema ticket. I have paid for so many bad movies that should not exist that playing a game for a hour and paying same price seems like good deal.
Cinema ticket costs about £4 - £5 in my country.

[merman]

I have paid for a few, more than £2-3 would make me think twice.

[Jbizzel]

I have paid £2 for a digital spectrum game. Any more that that and I would not buy it unless it was very special and polished.

Nothing and Deltas shadow fall into that last bracket.

I hardly have any time to play games, and prefer to code more that I prefer to play, so frankly speaking, I have hardly played any of the games I have bought. They sit on my harddrive.

Maybe there is a split, between gamers and people who like to dabble with code and hardware. I fall into the latter bracket. I'm a spectrum owner after all. That's the whole point!

It's a careful balance, because if all homebrew games go behind a paywall I think it will be bad for the community. At least a playable demo gets round that.

I think people like to buy physical items. I'd be more likely to pay £12 for Raval Gangs on tape than I am to buy it digitally for £2.

These are just my thoughts. Your game looks excellent and it's surely worth the price you have suggested.

[Nitrowing]

£2 for digital
£10 for physical
I've got around 300 PC games, the majority have never been played too busy killing kids in Fortnite

[catmeows]

too busy killing kids in Fortnite

Still better than being busy by dying in Fortnite::D

[patters]

Let it be recorded that I will pay £2.99 for Go Go Bunny Gun. When it's released. Just saying

[firelord]

...
I hardly have any time to play games, and prefer to code more that I prefer to play, so frankly speaking, I have hardly played any of the games I have bought. They sit on my harddrive.
...

I fall in the same category...
I almost never play the games. I just "check" them out. In fact the only thing I do is SGD database related : I open a game and grab a screenshot or check if the pokes work. DOS emulation will still exist for many years so I guess It's not a complete waste of time !

I bought Ukraine bundle and I have't actually played any game. I just checked the most interesting and marked them so in the future I might return to them.

Since I never actually spend time to play a game (even for Loxley I spend just a few minutes) it is difficult to spend money for a single game.

As I said in another thread I could spend money for a bundle of ZX games/applications (even if it's not for charity -just developers).

[Jbizzel]

too busy killing kids in Fortnite

Still better than being busy by dying in Fortnite::D

I played fortnight with my 8 year-old. I must admit, the first time I got a victory royal in solos I was quite excited

[presh]

OK, some useful info here, thanks everybody so far

It very much seems like a demo is the way to go... I appreciate there are people who don't allocate much time to playing games (I'm one myself, spending most of my Speccy time coding rather than playing), so they can still have a go without being forced to spend any cash.

But I'm hopeful that at least a few people will enjoy/complete the demo and want to play the rest of it. That is the price point that I'm interested in... achieving a good price for the buyer without feeling like I'm robbing myself in the process by setting it below what people are 100% happy to pay.

Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be a "minimum payment" option on itch, as I could just set that to something small and let people throw in a bit more if they wanted to. It's a shame, as this seems to work well for bands/musicians on Bandcamp. I'd happily put it up for "£1 or more" if that was the case, at least I'd get my quid!

There's also the argument that people don't really attach any value to things they get cheap or for free, which is why they end up unplayed.

It also becomes trickier when you take into account that a cheaper game may sell more copies and therefore make more money than a more expensive one which sells less copies!

Regarding actual sales of Rival Gangs... the overwhelming majority paid the suggested price of $2.99 (approx. £2.30) - some above, some below (ranging from $1 to $7.99) - the overall average works out at $2.9925

So at the moment, I'm still thinking $2.99 is about right.

[flatduckrecords]

Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be a "minimum payment" option on itch, as I could just set that to something small and let people throw in a bit more if they wanted to. It's a shame, as this seems to work well for bands/musicians on Bandcamp. I'd happily put it up for "£1 or more" if that was the case, at least I'd get my quid!

I think that is possible, I think you can always choose to add more. E.g. here’s Chez Maxime, “purchase for $4 or more”. Free games have the option of donating as well. I’m not sure if it’s a setting though, I’ve never sold anything on there, only bought a few things.



I find it hard to keep up with all the new releases, but recently I’ve been trying to support a few devs by purchasing or donating. …no doubt just encouraging them and making the problem worse for everyone!

[presh]

Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be a "minimum payment" option on itch, as I could just set that to something small and let people throw in a bit more if they wanted to. It's a shame, as this seems to work well for bands/musicians on Bandcamp. I'd happily put it up for "£1 or more" if that was the case, at least I'd get my quid!

I think that is possible, I think you can always choose to add more. E.g. here’s Chez Maxime, “purchase for $4 or more”. Free games have the option of donating as well. I’m not sure if it’s a setting though, I’ve never sold anything on there, only bought a few things.

Thanks @flatduckrecords, you're right!

You only set the minimum price...

[vintage-mike]

For what its worth - in my, so far, limited experience as a retro game developer - I've found the price makes almost no difference whatever. For example I assumed that releasing my games for £4.95 (That includes, audio files for ZX machines, tap, tzx files and a standalone PC version for Windows and Linux, with CRT emulation - so not exactly just a ZX Spectrum game) would be the kind of price point where people would be willing to take a gamble (and hopefully be pleased they did) .
My goal was to cover my costs, not to try and get rich. - I used to buy games on cassette based only on adverts, back when £4.95 really was £4.95.. and part of the excitement was hoping the game would turn out as good as I had hoped (not always the case).
However it appears that for the vast majority £4.95 is too much risk to take. (in fact even half that seems too much). The general 'advice' I've been given being that 'you should try to sell many at a low price rather than a few at a high price'. That makes sense, but its becoming rapidly apparent that (in my case) this doesn't scale. My guess is that there are actually only a few hundred 'potential' customers for a modern (or maybe any) ZX Spectrum game, and the nominal conversion rate (for just about anything) is around 2 - 5% at best. It costs me a couple of thousand pounds a year (minimum) to host, run, administrate and generally self publish the content - when you factor in the cost of advertising too - so at this stage I don't expect to be able to justify (bank rolling) this adventure for much longer. Facebook likes, or other tokens of approval just don't translate into sales. I mention all of this as a cautionary tale to anyone thinking of publishing (ZX Spectrum) games - your mileage may vary - but what I can say is that for anyone wondering if e.g. £4.95 is too much for a game - as regards the games I've made, my copies have cost me a lot more than that (and might possibly be the most expensive ZX Spectrum games I've ever owned, all things considered)